I do remember reading something about the conditions of anime workers (seiyuu / animators / etc.), probably on Hashihime or somewhere, and it certainly is worrying. I wonder if this is representative of a lot of the job industry in Japan (mainly because of all the talk in Kaiji about how a few million yen – i.e. a few tens of thousands of dollars – is far out of their reach). How many people would support this cause though, considering that raising their wages will likely drive prices higher? It’s an equally annoying ‘both hands tied’ situation.

Cameron: Pretty much on the money there, I think I mentioned something about how reverse importation is a sign that something’s messed up overseas as well, but if not, there it is. XD I do see how the Youtube-alike crowd is probably an important one; they lie in between the casual viewer (who tends to buy a lot of stuff anyway) and the hardcore Bittorrent user (who is probably hopeless), and most of them are probably teenagers like me with a little disposable income to spare, not being in college yet. How to get them interested though, is the problem; I saw it on your blog or somewhere that the whole “pity the industry and buy stuff please” idea is flawed and won’t work, and I agree, but it’s hard to find an alternative. You can’t just clamp down on the free distribution and risk alienating fans (kind of like how BVUSA did with True Tears and Shigofumi; yeah, that stopped people…), but I don’t think physical property / bonuses like the ones I suggested in the original post will attract a lot of people aside from die-hards like me. And paying for the exact same thing as something that is free is questionable at best.

And on that note –

Nekonron: I’m not familiar with how much revenue online streaming makes; $600K feels a bit high, as that’s be roughly $20K a day, but maybe established companies in the industry could pull it off. It sounds promising, since it would offer a free product and still make money for the company, but there’s some sense of “too good to be true” there. It’s worth a shot at least – I think ADV is trying something similar with the whole “Anime Network On Demand” thing.

(Oh, and regarding ADV’s Blu-ray; I heard Byousoku 5cm was going to be one of the titles for that program. Haven’t seen it yet but I’ve heard it’s stunning and the thought of it in uber-hi-def makes me drool and want a PS3. XD)

Dirian: I read an article about the same thing you proposed a few days ago, and it seems like an intriguing compromise. Adapting to that model though, worries me; the Japanese execs might be too uptight for it, the anime community might feel a sense of “selling out”, and quite a few translation groups have a rather unprofessional manner. (Although, I suppose, the ‘good’ ones contracted would be more professional.) It’d be an interesting bond between industry and consumer that I don’t think could be seen in any other industry.

Free streaming to DVD release, though, I’m not so sure about; that’s kind of the model we’re working off of right now (although the anime companies aren’t gaining anything from the current one), and it’s the question of “I saw it once, would I really want to pay to see it again?” Just because a series is popular doesn’t mean that it’s enduring, I think.

This is good discussion, everyone. Thanks for participating. ^^

Then the R1 companies can be like “hey THAT series was really popular, lets print DVDs of that one”, and go to work releasing those. It would get people their anime worldwide around the same time on a “watch before you buy” basis, and they’ll snap alot of the people who mostly watch anime only through fansubs, which means they’ll be making infinitely more money than they are now from that same crowd who, much as many want to support the industry, don’t want to pay $40 a disc, or wait over a year to see a good series.

It might be that you’re right and that free streaming, or another form of digital distribution is going to be just too hard to implement, but it seems to me that it’s the most likely thing to save the industry by getting alot of the fansub watchers to watch something that provides revenue to the actual creators. Sure the hardcore leechers might not get on board, but I’d wager that ALOT of people that watch fansubs almost exclusively do so more because it’s the only real option atm to get their anime now.

About streaming again, if one would assume that it cost $50k to release one episode, and a company releases 3 different series simultaneously (which is a fair amount), we could estimate that the weekly cost would be around $150k, and $600k/month. I think its very possible to recoup that amount of money every month just from revenues generated online through streaming and seeing how something like this would generate a lot of publicity the traffic could take off almost immediately.

It might seem very risky, especially with the amount of initial investment and work required, but it could be where the future lies in my opinion.

And thanks for fixing the link :D

Personally, I think they need to go after the YouTube/fansub crowd. I mean that’s the money they’re losing, evidently. Or at least that the money they keep saying that their losing. So I guess the question becomes how to do attract a crowd that is already getting it for free.

Like I said, you won’t find civility in this world.

And as for the whole barking up the wrong tree thing, shouldn’t we be rallying over fairer working conditions for the animators and seiyuu, or at least a suitable monthly wage/royalty package? I mean, they are providing a service, after all, shouldn’t they be paid appropriately?

But I’m dense. What ‘tree should we be barking up’, then? Or is it that we shouldn’t be at all?

IKnight: Haven’t thought a lot about HD-DVD / Blu-ray anime releases personally, as I’m stuck in the DVD era due to 1) the prohibitive entry fee of Blu-ray and 2) the obscurity of HD-DVD (you are right with your observation). Not sure if anime is releasing in HD-DVD overseas; I know I’ve seen Blu-ray releases, at least. Either way, I’ve seen that the results can be drop-dead sexy if done right – but if it’s a simple upscale, then I don’t know if it’s really worth it. That’s the thing sticking me on anime in higher-def; whether it’s really better-looking, and how much it will increase the cost (to produce in HD, etc.)

After all, I’ve watched 15-year-old anime on DVD on a big screen, and that’s just silly.

Nekonron: My point on the streaming is that it’s silly as a commercial industry, unless it’s a gateway to selling more physical copies. I think it’s good for previewing things and shorter videos, but for selling entire shows over, I’m not seeing it. Youtube and Crunchyroll, I imagine, survive because of huge traffic, and, like you said, no real fees outside of running the server. Plus, since there are so many free sites for it (with dubious copyright rules at times), commercial use of it would be hard. It could supplement income of a show, yes (especially for really old, hard to find shows), but it’s not the sole future.

(Oh, and I fixed your site link. Thanks for the heads up.)

But of course, one could argue that those sites do not have to go through the trouble of getting the license and subbing the shows, which does cost a small fortune. I’ve tried searching before on the cost of licensing + rolling out of anime but the information seems to be pretty difficult to come by. The only thing I got was that it can cost up to $50,000 per episode.

Then again, from the rate these sites are growing, I would say that its very possible to profit in the long run with proper planning and funding.

But I find your suggestion that reports of DVD’s demise might be exaggerated quite interesting. I know I do like to have a physical thing representing my love of whatever series it is.

Still, there remains the problem that the HD war doesn’t seem to be over – and I for one haven’t actually seen an HD DVD player in anyone’s home (as opposed to a shop window) yet, though that could be because the UK tends to be more cautious – and HD digisubs look a lot better than DVD equivalents (Gundam 00 is sex on a screen in high resolution). In fact, this isn’t just an issue with HD – my Macross Plus DVDs are genuinely uglier than their fansub equivalents. But I lack the technical knowledge to say why.

Also: Latin is in ur reCAPTCHA, educatin ur visitors.

Where fans turn on fans in the name of greed, superiority complexes and lazy thinking, I’m actually shocked we’ve lasted this long.

This community should have been dead a long time ago.

I hear fans talking about the imminent implosion of the animation community, and guess what? Fuckers actually approve of any action taken by shady, inethical businessmen! To save what? The bloody fucking industry!

Justin Sevakis, Zac BerI’mabloodyfucker, the big Bandai (let’s not kid ourselves here, it’s the same Bandai who brings us the gunpla, owns Sunrise and owns Bandai Visual here. Drop the pretense that Bandai Visual is a completely different entity.) fucks who demand more money for faster releases? They’re all fuckers in my eyes? DarkMirage, the majority of bigoted fansubbers and pretty much anyone who think fansubs are t3h win? They’re all bloody fuckers.

You spineless hypocritical fucks. Die in a fire, get ostracized, whatever. If you want to die so badly, I’ll be glad to wring every single bit of life out of you. Or ride that nuke, Dr. Strangelove-style.

Go to Hell.

Get used to the hate. It’s everywhere. And nothing will change that.